We got mail…

So Adventist it hurt

I was so Adventist it hurt. Your ministry has changed my life, set me free, and now I know who Jesus really is. I have placed my full trust and dependence on Him and am emotionally and eternally grateful for the example you set, the words you speak, and the way you walk. I thank God for you and pray for you.

—VIA EMAIL

 

Children living in terror and trauma

I’m hoping you can help me! I am a Christian woman leading a women’s Bible study at an evangelical Christian church (Alliance denomination).

 A lady has just started attending who is Adventist, and although she seems to have understood the doctrine of grace, she also seems to have some very off-base beliefs about her children being under attack by demons and refers to spiritual battle with and for them. Is this Adventist theology?

 I am concerned her four children are being led to live in terror, and may also be traumatized by her addressing what seems to me as behavioral challenges, as a physical form of spiritual warfare. She is the children’s only influence as she is a widow, is estranged from her family, homeschools the children, and keeps them extremely isolated. With Covid they are even more isolated than before. 

What blows me away is how much my Adventist friends (I have another Adventist friend, too) love Scripture and yet twist it so! I have come to understand it is Ellen White’s teachings that cause them to misinterpret the Bible. She sent me the following quote from Ellen White yesterday when I asked how she came to believe the problem with her children is spiritual attack and not simple behavior:

When you decide that as Christians you are not required to restrain your thoughts and feelings you are brought under the influence of evil angels and invite their presence and their control. If you yield to your impressions and allow your thoughts to run in a channel of suspicion, doubt, and repining you will be among the most unhappy of mortals, and your lives will prove a failure (5T 310.1).

She lives out of town and attends Bible study by Zoom, so my ability to meet with her is very limited, as her children always seem to be in ear shot.

I was raised in a converted Mennonite family, so in some ways I can relate to how difficult it is to come to an understanding of grace and imputed righteousness. 

 I would appreciate any advice or insight you could provide, if possible.

—VIA EMAIL

Response: This spiritual warfare focus is not mainstream Adventism, but it is very common among conservative, historic Adventists. I can believe that with her isolationist tactics, those children are in a scary environment. It sounds as if she is attributing their misbehavior to demonic oppression and is trying to pray the demons out of them. Adventists often do this, especially when they feel trapped and helpless. The kids are undoubtedly learning that they are “bad” and that they are the cause of their mom’s out-of-control behavior. 

The thing about Adventism is that most Adventists do not really know or believe the gospel. They know how to talk the talk to “outsiders”, but they believe that Jesus did not complete the atonement at the cross, and when they say they are saved by grace, they mean that God graciously helps them behave better. They believe that God’s “grace” sent Jesus to die so that they would somehow be able to appreciate how much He suffered for them and then ask Him to come into their hearts to help them be good with His power. Their understanding of the righteousness of Christ is not IMPUTED righteousness; they believe in IMPARTED righteousness—that Christ makes it possible, by example and by His help, for them to obey the law. They absolutely believe they must keep the seventh-day Sabbath to demonstrate that they love God, and if they give it up, they will lose their chance for salvation.

They do not believe they can ever know they are saved because Jesus is in heaven evaluating them, watching to see if they choose to “obey” Him and keep those commandments and those food laws and also to see if they are disciplining their children and making sure they are obedient Adventists. Their prophetess Ellen White said that if one’s children are not “saved” when Jesus comes back, He will look at the parents and ask, “Where is thy flock, thy beautiful flock?” And the parents will be punished for not having gotten their children to be obedient Adventists. 

I share your concerns for the children. Domestic abuse is extremely common in Adventist families. With the isolation you describe, I suspect the possibility of severe punishments and emotional and spiritual abuse is very high. I can’t say for sure, but I have major red flags. 

I am going to send you a couple of links that may help you, and I’m also going to sign you up for our weekly email that I suspect you may enjoy as well. It has great articles that give insight into Adventism and also into Scripture and living as Christians. In addition, I suspect you may find our podcasts helpful. We have had people who are in relationships with Adventists say that the podcasts have helped them understand where the Adventists are “coming from”:

• https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/former-adventist/id1482887969
• Spiritual Abuse Among Religions
• What Is Seventh-day Adventism?

 

Will I see my parents in heaven?

I have been listening to your podcasts on Spotify. My sister-in-law shared with me some of the fallacies of the Adventist church beliefs. I am at least a fourth generation Adventist, and my father was a pastor in the Adventist church. He and my mother were killed some years ago, but during his life he preached the word he knew and the second coming of Christ until his death.

I just listened to podcast #23 you gave about the assurance of our salvation and the investigative judgement. (I have listened to every podcast in order to this point.) But after listening to this podcast I am wondering if I will see my parents in heaven. How can I know? Where can I read to find out? I know they loved the Lord that they knew. Please, I am searching for so many answers. My parents were so special to me.

On a great note, I have so been enjoying reading my Bible through new eyes and realizing that my simple, childlike mind can understand the Bible for how it is written and not with all the EG White depression of never knowing if I am saved. Please keep doing what you are doing. Pray that I will be able help my husband see what I am seeing and our children learn about the true Jesus I am beginning to learn about. I love Jesus and what he has done for me and am so amazed at how he can love me so much.

—VIA EMAIL

Response: You know, sometimes we don’t have clear answers about our loved ones who died. If your parents trusted Jesus alone for their forgiveness and righteousness, God knew. There is always some uncertainty when we think about our Adventist family; Richard, for example, never had any assurance that his parents trusted Jesus alone. They were historic, loyal Adventists, and there was never any certainty in his mind. They both died in 2019, and he says that he knew he could trust Jesus with them. 

The Lord knows how to reveal Himself and His sufficiency to people even when they are unconscious or demented. His Spirit can communicate with their spirits in a way that doesn’t require words or consciousness. We can never rule out that the Lord may deal with people as they are dying. He knows His own, and He loses none the Father gives Him. 

All this is to say that even if we do not have clear answers about our loved ones who have died, we DO know our sovereign, loving God. He loves your parents even more than you do, and you can trust Him to deal justly and lovingly with them. Meanwhile, we live without concrete answers, but we live knowing that the Lord is utterly trustworthy and that He is drawing you to Himself, and He is at work in your family as well.

It is very hard to have a husband who isn’t studying along with you; I am praying now that you will know how to love him for God, honoring him and speaking the truth when the Lord gives you the opportunity. 

I am sorry that I cannot give you any more definitive answers; much of our life is lived by sheer faith in the Son of God who sees all, knows all, and is sovereign. He is our Savior and the One who loves us enough to have died for us. You can trust Him with your parents! 

I am so thankful that the Lord is revealing Himself and His word to you! The Bible truly is a new book when we trust Jesus alone and let the false prophet go!